Protesters hold sit-in at the UC Berkeley registrar’s office in Sproul Hall

Members of BAMN and the Defend Affirmative Action Party occupy the Office of the Registrar in Sproul Hall.
Derek Remsburg/Staff
Members of BAMN and the Defend Affirmative Action Party occupy the Office of the Registrar in Sproul Hall.

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What began as a demonstration in favor of affirmative action Friday afternoon became an occupation of UC Berkeley’s Office of the Registrar.At noon, demonstrators from the activist group BAMN and the Defend Affirmative Action Party gave speeches on the steps of Sproul Plaza, demanding that campus minority enrollment double and that charges against Nov. 9 Occupy Cal protesters be dropped.

About 20 protesters then marched into Sproul Hall and began their sit-in at the registrar’s office, which lasted until about 4:35 p.m.

“I’m in classes like O-chem and biology, and I don’t see students who look like me,” said junior Alisha Johnson, a black candidate for external affairs vice president with the Defend Affirmative Action Party in this year’s ASUC elections. “It frustrates the heck out of me.”

Although a Thursday BAMN press release stated that minority high school students who were not admitted to the campus would join East Bay high school and college students at the protest, the protesters were mainly comprised of DAAP and BAMN activists with a smattering of high school students.

The demonstration comes four days after the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals rejected a challenge to Proposition 209, keeping in place the state’s voter based-ban on the consideration of race as a factor in admissions to the UC. The lawsuit challenging the proposition was brought forth by BAMN.

Some onlookers of the Friday demonstrations expressed concerns about the implications of the protester’s message.

“By their logic, they will kick out over-represented groups on campus,” said sophomore Max Jason.

After occupying the office for nearly an hour, representatives from the administration — including Vice Chancellor for Equity and Inclusion Gibor Basri — came to speak with protesters and receive their petitions that demand that the campus double minority enrollment and that the criminal charges against Nov. 9 Occupy Cal protesters be dropped.

Basri explained that the university is bound by Proposition 209 to admit students without consideration of race.

“This problem is more complicated than you’re presenting it,” Basri said.

UCPD closed Sproul Hall around 4 p.m. but never received further instruction from the administration as to the fate of the sit-in, according to UCPD Lt. Marc DeCoulode.

A dozen remaining protesters voluntarily decided to end their sit-in about half an hour later. After exiting Sproul Hall, the protesters held a final rally as some students passed by and then headed to the ASUC Candidates Forum.

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  • God’s Child

    For a child that is Portuguese/Russian on moms side and black/Irish on dad’s side to say there is no one like her in her class. I believe you might be wrong Alisha.

  • Calipenguin

    “I’m in classes like O-chem and biology, and I don’t see students who
    look like me,” said junior Alisha Johnson, a black candidate for
    external affairs vice president with the Defend Affirmative Action Party
    in this year’s ASUC elections. “It frustrates the heck out of me.”

    I’m so sorry to hear that Alisha!  The university should not hurt the feelings of its students.  I hereby propose that Cal open its O-chem and Biology classrooms to black female students from local community colleges so that they can keep Alisha company.  Berkeley High Junior and Senior girls with dark enough skin pigmentation may attend as well.   

  • ArwenUndomniel

       I admire these students for th courage to act on their convictions.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WRACM77JT2RXUR3LMGDPPUGUYY Tony M

       What convictions? The belief that they should be admitted on the basis of skin color as opposed to academic performance?

    • Calipenguin

       I agree they have courage.  However, their conviction is nothing more than a misplaced sense of entitlement, simply because they have darker skin.  These convictions were taught by liberal teachers, relatives, and community leaders and unfairly tilt the playing field even when the most powerful man in America is Black.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WRACM77JT2RXUR3LMGDPPUGUYY Tony M

         I don’t know that I would call it “courage”, more like “nerve”…

  • ArwenUndomniel

    Anya, you are assuming that “scores” and “rigorous academic background” is what is needed to succeed at UCB and it is only people with both are what we want in society. Contrary to your assertion we want a diversity of students with different backgrounds and not necessarily the high scores and “rigorous academic background”. We are a diverse society with many constituencies and communities who are in need of educated individuals.

       Cal has been around for a very long time and has only tightened their requirements and raised their fees to admit the rich and those coming the highest achieving who perform well on test but have no interest in helping the diverse populations in our nation.

       Cal has always prided itself over the years in having a diverse student body and is one of the reasons students apply to the University. It is the University whose students started the Free Speech Movement among many other things. Its students were on the cutting edge of revolutionary thought and social change.

        What are you doing at Cal if you do not support this proposition? You could always go to a private institution on the East Coast or perhaps in Paris or London. These universities may be much more suitable for you. They may well welcome you with open arms because of your “scores” and “rigorous academic background”. But then again maybe you applied are your scores were not high enough for them. Perhaps Cal was your second or third choice?  

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WRACM77JT2RXUR3LMGDPPUGUYY Tony M

       [Anya, you are assuming that “scores” and “rigorous academic background”
      is what is needed to succeed at UCB and it is only people with both are
      what we want in society.]

      What “we” want (and I’m presuming that means what YOU want) in society and what is necessary for success at Cal are two different things altogether.

    • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WRACM77JT2RXUR3LMGDPPUGUYY Tony M

      What are you doing at Cal if you do not support this proposition?

      Maybe unlike you, some people are at Cal based on their own merits, for the purpose of getting a useful education that will allow them to become taxpayers and productive citizens, instead of professional parasite activists…

      You could always go to a private institution on the East Coast or perhaps in Paris or London. These universities may be much more suitable for you

      You make a lot of assumptions about others, don’t you?

    • Calipenguin

       Arwen, of course we want a diverse society.  That’s what CSU and community colleges are for.  Good students who represent a diverse range of racial and religious groups, but whose grades and test scores are just a bit low for Cal, can always go to CSU for a good, solid education.  It’s unfair to the underrepresented minorities to accept them to Cal when they don’t have the brainpower to keep up with Cal students who were accepted purely on academic merit.  Once the CSU and UC students graduate, they can work together and ensure racial diversity in the work place.

  • BAMN Member

    GO GET EM BAMN!!

    • Stan De San Diego

       Go get a real job.

  • Eric

    how about double the number of good looking girls instead

    • http://www.facebook.com/VoteforChange2012 Christopher Neal

      Affirmative Action is illegal for good reason.

  • http://www.facebook.com/VoteforChange2012 Christopher Neal

    Well, shit! What about the Chinese and the Russians, why only black, Latino, and Natives? Damn, these people suck!–Buncha racists!!! –They only want people who look like them to have exceptions made for…

  • Stan De San Diego

    “I’m in classes like O-chem and biology, and I don’t see students who look like me,” said junior Alisha Johnson, a black candidate for external affairs vice president with the Defend Affirmative Action Party in this year’s ASUC elections. “It frustrates the heck out of me.”

    Why?

  • Stan De San Diego

    Translation: “I spent 4 years studying useless basket-weaving courses at Cal and all I got was this T-shirt.”

  • Cieplak

    “I’m in classes like O-chem and biology, and I don’t see students who look like me”

    Yup that’s true.
    Plus about a third of the students that are in chem 3b or 112b don’t belong in those courses.
    They have no interest in the material, they don’t make the necessary effort.
    (and that’s really saying something b/c on this campus those organic chemistry courses are not as hard as they could or should be, ya’ll are spoiled)
    So in a sane world there would be plenty of open spots in those courses.

  • anya

    How would that help them?  If someone doesn’t have the scores and the rigorous academic background to get into UCB, why should they go to UCB?  They’ll be so far behind academically that their only options will be to flunk out of the real classes (there’s no way an unprepared student could compete with students from the magnet schools), or take the fluff ethnic studies classes which grade you on your knowledge of how to hate white people.  And what employer is going to take that degree seriously?

    The solution is to start with the family, the the pre-school, then the elementary school, and so on… and make sure the minorities will not only be able to get into UCB, but excel there.  Affirmative action is just a band-aid that eventually leads to failure.

    • Guest

      The voice of reason.

  • Guest

    To be honest, they wasted everybody’s time. I had to drop off a scholarship and was unable to because they had “occupied” the building. Usually I’m a supporter of their behavior, but this was just stupid.

    • Guest

      So you support their behavior insofar as it doesn’t cause you the slightest bit of inconvenience?

      Now THAT’S just stupid.

  • GeorgeM

    I notice that no one can yet explain why the currently enrolled minority students are not in OChem.    Since the current blacks don’t want it, what makes Alisha think that future blacks will have a different choice of majors?    So maybe we need to specifically increase enrollment of blacks who like science/math and decrease enrollment of blacks who like social sciences.

    • steph

      maybe because african americans number only 3% of the student population? even if every single african american student who is a freshman took ochem (less than 150 for both cal and ucla combined) they wouldn’t fill it up. 

  • GoldenBear

    It is difficult to shake the spiteful remarks of certain people when idiotic demagogues keep adding fuel to the flames. First, it is typical to read comments on this site from students taking shots at minorities because they perceive them as “back door affirmative action admits”.  Second, when demagogues espouse affirmative action (AA) they hurt both the very people they claim to be supporting and also those discriminated against if AA were set into place.

    I recommend a close reading of Shelby Steele’s essays for an in depth analysis of the subject.  It is quite clear that AA helps no one and hurts us all.

  • Guest

    Yvette Felarca is a malignant tumor.  Geez.  Has she ever done anything productive, or creative, in her life?  Professional protesting…wow.

    On a more somber note, this ultra-fringe and ultra-vocal group is asking for stuff that will drive the University into the ground, for good.  Dumbing down…never a good idea.

    “When it comes to IQ…you just have to be elitist” – Bill Gates

    • Guest

      Nice made-up quotation – a Google search for the components of that quotation brings up only this article.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WRACM77JT2RXUR3LMGDPPUGUYY Tony M

         Valid question as far as I’m concerned. Has this professional pest Felarca ever contributed anything other than be a constant attention whore for herself and her silly little causes?

      • Guest

        It’s a paraphrase – pick up the most recent issue of Fortune Magazine, about the top 12 entrepreneurs in the world.

      • Guest

        Here you go, Yvette:

         “They key for us, number one, has always been hiring very smart people,” says Gates. “There is no way of getting around, that in terms of IQ, you’ve got to be very elitist in picking people who deserve to write software”

        http://www.evancarmichael.com/Famous-Entrepreneurs/556/Lesson-2-Develop-an-ATeam.html

        You may want to learn to like, Google better.

        • http://www.facebook.com/VoteforChange2012 Christopher Neal

          Yeah, ya’all, can’t we just leave it as: “”When it comes to IQ…you just have to be elitist” – Guest.

      • Adf

        The quote is: “In terms of IQ, you’ve got to be very elitist in picking the people who deserve to write software.”

        You’re google-fu must be pretty bad if you couldn’t find it…

        http://bit.ly/Htvqo6

    • student

      yvette felarca teaches at MLK middle school. she has a full time job in addition to her activist work. she knows firsthand that closing the achievement gap at a young age is important, and she works to do that every single day, but it’s not enough when there is systematic institutional oppression keeping the students she teaches everyday out of universities like cal.

  • GeorgeM

    And at 5pm Felarca gave up.  She was hungry, and she took her minions with her to go to McDonald’s.

    • reztips

      So Felarca and her minions went to McDonalds. That’s where the African Americans she wants admitted to Cal will wind up working, if they work at all…

      • reztips

        Addendum: McDonalds is among the few employers who see any value in degrees “earned” in Ethnic Studies…

        • http://www.facebook.com/VoteforChange2012 Christopher Neal

          I cannot believe Berkeley would even offer something as useless as Ethnic Studies. I swear, the school should just be honest and tell the students, sheesh!

  • reztips

    Carlos, below, makes a good point. When Alisha Johnson asks why she doesn’t see more fellow blacks in her organic chem and bio courses, she should ask the African American Students in Ethnic Studies why they don’t try to actually learn something at UCB by taking some science courses instead of Victimhood 1 or Victimhood 2.

    Sorry, but to be honest, if African American enrollment doubled at Cal, the school would have to hire a flock of new instructors to teach remedial English and basic math skills. Should BAMN achieve its goals, UCB will become so dumbed down that a diploma from Cal won’t be worth used toilet paper…

    • libsrclowns

      Alisha is frustrated. Yawn. Meritocracy rules.

    • JJMMC

      ” …if African American enrollment doubled at Cal, the school would have to hire a flock of new instructors to teach remedial English and basic math skills. ”

      What. The. Fuck.

    • Asian

      I think there would be less of a need for remedial English.  If anything, Asians need remedial English.

      • http://www.facebook.com/VoteforChange2012 Christopher Neal

        In all truth, Latinos are very over-represented in remedial English courses.

    • GoldenBear

      Your comment is the epitome of ignorance.  You assume that an entire group of students would require “remedial English and basic math skills”, just because of their ethnicity–what a generalization. 

      P.S.  Still upset because of Farrakhan? Get over it, he is a sick retard supported by a few idiots, but why take it out on an entire group of people you don’t even know?  Talk about playing the very role you despise.

      • reztips

        JJ and Golden, the reason they currently can’t get into UCB is their failure to achieve academically. More qualified students were accepted ahead of them and if the African American enrollment were doubled, not only would better students be denied a place at Cal but those who were accepted purely on the basis of their color would doubtless include many who were deficient in basic college skills…

        • GoldenBear

          Reztips,

          We can assume that there are a limited amount of spots and many potentially qualifying students applying to the UCB in any given year. With that said, some or many of the applicants not admitted into UCB may have exhibited the required academic achievements. This is a given, so that the pool of students not admitted into the university is composed both of worthy students and those that as you stated “failed to achieve academically”.

          Again, your singling out of an entire ethnic group is a generalization. Unless of course you support your perspective with something a but more convincing, such as the admissions criteria, the amount of applicants turned down and the qualifications of those applicants as compared to the admitted applicants.

          • reztips

            Golden, it’s BAMN who is-in your words-singling out an ethnic group. And BAMN wants to double its enrollment. Unfortunately, poor parenting and lousy primary & secondary public schools would lead to many members of those proposed to “double” black enrollment taking the place of those far more academically qualified. 

            And I will state the truth again, a significant percentage of such doubling of African American enrollment would require Cal to provide the teaching of remedial skills requisite for much of this increment just to keep their heads above water at UCB. Better that they garner such fundamental skills at a junior college first, rather than displace those manifestly more academically qualified.

            The bottom line, and I’m certain Dr. King would have agreed, you don’t end discrimination by discriminating…

          • GoldenBear

            Reztips, I agree with you about BAMN.  But you still generalized, and did so again.  Are you to tell me you have access to the parenting that goes on in the households of students not admitted into UCB?

            Again, you stated an OPINION. Don’t confuse an opinion with an argument supported by facts. 

          • Stan De San Diego

            “We can assume that there are a limited amount of spots and many
            potentially qualifying students applying to the UCB in any given year.”

            Yes, but what makes you think that those “potentially qualifying students” in a given subject matter are in the same proportion racially as the population at large? Let me bring up the example of transfer students from California’s community college system. I was a transfer student who attended CC at 3 different locations in order to get the courses I needed to transfer to a 4-year college. All 3 schools can be considered racially “diverse”, including the one where I did my chemistry, physics, and related coursework.

            According to the dean of their Science Department at that CC, there were about 600 students who were on some form of college admissions track when I attended. Even though about 20% of the students there were black, and another 20% were hispanic, I recall at most about a dozen black students altogether in my 5 semesters of chemistry and 3 semesters of physics, and half of those were foreign students from either Africa or the West Indies. Therefore, only about 1% of the students in the sciences were black African-Americans, alleged victims of “institutional racism”.

            An even bigger contrast was when I attended LACC at the campus off of Vermont Blvd. in Hollywood. The campus was primarily hispanic, asian, and black – whites were clearly a minority. I recall 2 hispanics in those math classes, and NO black students whatsoever.

            Now the great thing about the community college system is that it offers everyone a “second chance” at college. There are no GPA requirements to get in, you can take remedial courses to bring yourself up to speed if you have been out of school for a few years, and the cost is rather inexpensive. But if you can’t get a decent GPA at a CC where you can basically take classes at your own pace, whose fault is that?

            More importantly, if less than 1% of those students even ATTEMPTING to take math/science courses are of a given minority, why would you expect that their proportion of the “qualified” student candidates be ANYWHERE close to the 10-12% of the population? Merely because the percentages of admissions don’t reflect the population at whole is a pretty lame excuse to cry “racism”.

          • GoldenBear

            [Yes, but what makes you think that those “potentially qualifying
            students” in a given subject matter are in the same proportion racially
            as the population at large?]

            Actually, I don’t assume anything.   Data gathered each year (should) display the ethnic composition of admits.  I’m uncertain if the ethnic background of those not admitted is retained.

            Also, the data you provide (taken from a dean at some CC?) focuses exclusively on science.  My comments have focused on admits into UCB indiscriminately of their intended majors or course of study.      But, I concede that if accurate the information is insightful.

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WRACM77JT2RXUR3LMGDPPUGUYY Tony M

        [Your comment is the epitome of ignorance.  You assume that an entire
        group of students would require “remedial English and basic math
        skills”, just because of their ethnicity–what a generalization. ]

        He didn’t say “an entire group”. What he pointed out was the truth. The reason there aren’t more African-Americans in the UC system, especially in the sciences, is that there simply aren’t a whole lot available. Those that are qualified are courted by other universities and offered lucrative scholarships to satisfy the “diversity” demands of other institutions. The black students who CAN make it into Cal on their grades as chemistry majors aren’t being denied college educations due to some form on institutional discrimination AGAINST them – in fact, it’s quite the opposite. They are being chased down by recruiters from the University of Delaware, Minnesota, Wisconsin and other schools with quite respectable reputations in this particular field, not to mention the likes of Stanford, Cal Tech, et. al. In order to meet “diversity” requirements, you’re going to bring in B and C level students (literally and figuratively) who in most cases lack the preparation to make it through the program.

        There’s a reason why there’s a plethora of these race/victim grievance studies and other fluff humanities programs in academia these days, even though they produce students with useless degrees and no practical job skills whatsoever. Whether you care to admit it or not, these programs exist as a place to channel students who simply can’t make it through an academically demanding program, allowing the University to maintain the facade that they are “educating” all these students, so they can keep profs and administrators employed, milk the state and Feds for funding, and continue the charade…

        • http://www.facebook.com/VoteforChange2012 Christopher Neal

          So THAT’s why… But the only placement for the graduate is to become yet another libtard employed in academia…

        • GoldenBear

          [ if African American enrollment doubled at Cal, the school would have to
          hire a flock of new instructors to teach remedial English and basic
          math skills.]

          (i) As the citation above clearly demonstrates Reztips indiscriminately generalized about the linguistic and mathematical competency of entire group of people; i.e. African Americans

          {What he pointed out was the truth. The reason there aren’t more
          African-Americans in the UC system, especially in the sciences, is that
          there simply aren’t a whole lot available.]

          I generally do not accept as “truth” opinions unsupported by evidence.  In my opinion if you really want to make a case to the general public you would require stats that clearly indicate the amount of African Americans in California, the amount that applied to UCB, and the academic merit of both those that were admitted and not admitted. Also, if possible compare all of the aforementioned with comparable stats of other ethnicities.  If you do all this on a single year, then you made a case for an entire year, but to do so for a decade is to demonstrate a pattern. 

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WRACM77JT2RXUR3LMGDPPUGUYY Tony M

             [As the citation above clearly demonstrates Reztips indiscriminately
            generalized about the linguistic and mathematical competency of entire
            group of people; i.e. African Americans]

            He didn’t generalize, he told the truth. I not only attended a CC before being accepted to Cal, but actually worked in several capacities, from teacher’s aide, campus tutor, and salaried managerial employee. I can not only concur with the fact that there aren’t a lot of African Americans in science tracks at the CC, but I can also tell you which classes have the HIGHEST enrollment among blacks and hispanics at our CC: remedial English and remedial math. Not that there weren’t dumb, lazy white kids who skated through high school learning nothing as well, I’ll certainly admit to that. However, the fact that many of our CCs spend a disproportionate amount of resources to do the job our K-12 system failed to do makes it quite clear why the idea that there are all these “qualified” people of color who would be turned down for admission in the absence of AA is a myth.

          • GoldenBear

            [However, the fact that many of our CCs spend a disproportionate amount
            of resources to do the job our K-12 system failed to do makes it quite
            clear why the idea that there are all these “qualified” people of color
            who would be turned down for admission in the absence of AA is a myth.]

            First, your response is made towards an AA argument, one which I certainly wouldn’t make–at least not without statistical evidence to support a claim.

            Then, by analogy you reason that your experience in your CC substantiates the idea that qualified minorities are lacking. You do understand that your experience in one CC couldn’t possibly account for all students in the state. 

              I on the other hand would argue that qualified applicants may get turned down, but that shouldn’t be a problem let alone a red flag that “discrimination” is occuring.  Why?  There are a limited amount of spots and a tremendous amount of applicants.

             

  • 1776

    I wonder what Martin Luther King Jr. would say to Alisha, probably something like

    “I have a dream that my four little children will one
    day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their
    skin, but by the content of their character.”

    If you want more African Americans to be admitted to the University perhaps you along with your BAMN friends should instead of focusing your resources on trying to overturn Prop 209 (which will never be overturned and most Californians support) you should focus on improving k-12 education and stress important values such as hard work and perseverance.

    But I guess that would be too hard, and plus white people like me are keeping you down…right???

    • Stan De San Diego

      “If you want more African Americans to be admitted to the University
      perhaps you along with your BAMN friends should instead of focusing your
      resources on trying to overturn Prop 209 (which will never be
      overturned and most Californians support) you should focus on improving
      k-12 education and stress important values such as hard work and
      perseverance.”

      True, but protesting is a lot easier, and with these spoiled little narcissists, it’s not about helping their fellow “people of color”, but all about getting attention.

    • GoldenBear

      Your comment is supported by two primary assumptions: (i) values such as “hard work and perseverance” are uniformly missing among all minorities; (ii) anyone that “made it” worked hard whereas anyone that didn’t “make it” lacked  “hard work and perseverance”.

      I agree with you in essence regarding the importance of  both values (hard work and perseverance), and appreciate the valid and practical advice offered to BAMN, as it is truly a solution: improving k-12 education in problem areas. How to do so is a matter and argument all together far more complicated than I care to engage in at the moment. 

      But yes, these people are the archetypical demagogues that certainly do not speak on my brown behalf.  There backwards notion of a free ticket puts all of us back decades: by allowing mediocrity to supplant competence and rigor and also to discriminate against some on behalf of others. 

    • Tralla la

      that’s probably more ignorant than racist.  k-12 education quality is heavily influenced by race, as many wealthy white communities, through taxes, pay for more resources per student at schools, attracting better teachers, while many poor communities are predominately communities of color (from the long legacy of racism) that have fewer tax dollars paying for school resources and don’t attract teachers as easily.  there’s a lot more to it.  like people’s expectations (see the racist shit below about math and english skills).  if you think kids are going to fail, you might help them do so.  ‘hard work and perseverance’ isn’t the missing quality.

      and it’s not a judgement to look at factors contributing to different experiences for individuals due to such as reason as their skin color.  it’s consciousness.

      • guest2

        The UC’s attempt to level the playing field by accepting students in the top 4% of their school’s graduating class, regardless of their high schools’ quality/rankings.

        The quality of K-12 education is very complicated as many factors play into this. Here’s an interesting article for those who believe socioeconomic status of the student influences achievement…
         http://articles.latimes.com/2008/jul/16/local/me-lincoln16

      • anya

        Then improve the K-12 education.  Don’t throw someone who’s had a bad education their wholes lives into the shark tank at UCB.  That’s just cruel and unproductive.

        • meh

          fyi, bamn does do work with k-12. and the protesters spoke with vice chancellor of equity and diversity, and he was telling us about all these things he was trying to do to raise the numbers. but still we see no rising black and latino student enrollment.  as we were protesting, a student and her parents came in. they were appealing her daughter’s rejection from cal. she is the top student at berkeley high. and she is latino. being the #1 student at her school says something about how intelligent and hardworking she is. being #1 at any school means you are a motivated student. and she was still rejected. 

          • Stan De San Diego

             “fyi, bamn does do work with k-12. and the protesters spoke with vice
            chancellor of equity and diversity, and he was telling us about all
            these things he was trying to do to raise the numbers. but still we see
            no rising black and latino student enrollment.”

            So everyone’s making all this effort, but enrollment doesn’t increase? Whose fault is that?

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WRACM77JT2RXUR3LMGDPPUGUYY Tony M

             [as we were protesting, a student and her parents came in. they were
            appealing her daughter’s rejection from cal. she is the top student at
            berkeley high. and she is latino. being the #1 student at her school

            Maybe the #1 student at her particular school isn’t as prepared as the #2 student elsewhere. Ever thought of that?

          • CITE_FACTS_USE_LOGIC

            Trust me, I wasn’t the #1 student at my school, yet the average Cal Engineering Student is much smarter than the #1 at my school was. Yet I’m at the top of my major now; that’s how much relevance being #1 has.

      • Stan De San Diego

         ” k-12 education quality is heavily influenced by race, as many wealthy
        white communities, through taxes, pay for more resources per student at
        schools”

        How do you explain school districts such as Marin City and Washington, DC, where spending is well above and beyond the national average, and student performance is still in the toilet. All the money in the world won’t help students stuck in a dysfunctional family and/or social subculture, which pretty much explains the wards of the social welfare state. It’s a culture of indolence and indifference to education, not a lack of funds, that explains why some groups don’t perform as well as others.

    • DNS

      Before you go blindly quoting MLK, why don’t you look at some other things he said.
      “Whenever the
      issue of compensatory treatment for the Negro is raised, some of our friends
      recoil in horror. The Negro should be granted equality, they agree, but he
      should ask nothing more. On the surface, this appears reasonable, but it is not
      realistic.” — 1964, Why We Can’t Wait.

      A section of the white population, perceiving Negro pressure for change,
      misconstrues it as a demand for privileges…The ensuing white backlash
      intimidates government officials who are already too timorous.” — “Negroes
      Are Not Moving Too Fast”

      “A society that
      has done something special against the Negro for hundreds of years must now do
      something special for the Negro…” quoted by Stephen B.Oates, Let The
      Trumpet Sound.

      I agree that university level affirmative action is not the best solution, and that a change in k-12 education would work much better, but your implicit assertion that all minorities lack values of hard work and perseverance is ignorant, digusting, and nothing more than subtle racism. So in response to your final question, yes white people are holding down minorities by holding ignorant attitudes like your own and failing to see that a change needs to be made. 

      • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WRACM77JT2RXUR3LMGDPPUGUYY Tony M

         [I agree that university level affirmative action is not the best
        solution, and that a change in k-12 education would work much better,
        but your implicit assertion that all minorities lack values of hard work
        and perseverance is ignorant, digusting, and nothing more than subtle
        racism.]

        He never said such, so why don’t you knock off the silly extrapolations. Seriously now, if some of you spent as much time hitting the books as you do whining about not having some free pass via Affirmative Action, you might be in a lot better position today.

        • DNS

          He didn’t say such, hence the use of the word implicit. The statement implied that minorities don’t work hard or persevere and need to be told to do such. Also, don’t generalize all supporters of affirmative action by saying they should stop whining and hit the books more. How are working hard/ studying and protesting for a cause you believe in mutually exclusive? How can you imply that those who support affirmative action and other similar policies don’t also work hard? You have no idea how hard they may or may not work, and generalizing them without that knowledge is just lazy. Also, why is the concept of affirmative action and similar corrective policies so ridiculous to people? It’s not requesting a free hand out, but simply suggesting that a society that has discriminated against certain groups for centuries and that still puts those groups at an inherent disadvantage should do something to remedy the situation. Whether university level affirmative action is the right policy is perfectly debatable(and is something I disagree with), but the idea behind it-that there should be some corrective action on the behalf of minorities- is perfectly reasonable.

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_WRACM77JT2RXUR3LMGDPPUGUYY Tony M

             [He didn’t say such, hence the use of the word implicit. The statement
            implied that minorities don’t work hard or persevere and need to be told
            to do such.]

            Once again, you’re playing games. In case you’re not familiar with the English language, there’s a difference between the concept of SOME and ALL. If someone says that SOME of X group do or do not do something, that is NOT the same as saying ALL of them do the same. If you genuinely have difficulty understanding what is meant, then do yourself a favor and take a night course in English Comprehension. Otherwise, knock off the silly extrapolations, as it only makes you look dishonest.

            [Also, don’t generalize all supporters of affirmative action by saying
            they should stop whining and hit the books more. How are working hard/
            studying and protesting for a cause you believe in mutually exclusive?]

            The more time you spend protesting, the less time you have to do something constructive, such as studying. In addition, playing the victim eventually becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy. People who convince themselves they can’t make it usually wind up fulfilling their own predictions because they don’t make the effort. Last but not least, if you want to be a success, regardless of what endeavor (sports, entertainment, academia), then learn about the positive attributes of successful people and do what you can to emulate them. I know this is a completely foreign concept to liberals (who instinctively resent success and make excuses for failure) but it wouldn’t kill you to give it a try.

            [You have no idea how hard they may or may not work, and generalizing them without that knowledge is just lazy.]

            You apparently have no idea how hard successful students from third would countries work to make it into Cal and other UC campuses – and many of them have personally suffered a lot more in the way of genuine poverty and injustice than any “underrepresented” minority in this country. One of my neighbors when I lived in San Jose was a Vietnamese woman who with her sister fled the Communists that killed most of her family. She, her sister, and her uncle were the only survivors. She and her sister made it to the US (legally), learned English, worked her way through a series of menial jobs to where she was able to open a small restaurant. She has a son who was accepted (and graduated) from Davis, and a daughter who graduated from Cal. Her best friend, a Vietnamese lady who leases a chair at a local hair and nails place, is putting her daughter through Cal as well. Do you think their children were accepted based on their wealth or white privelege? No, they made it there based on their own work, as well as parents who intuitively understood the value of education, emphasized that value to their children, and supported their efforts. Maybe some of you people in your “underrepresented minorities” should get together in groups, rent a meeting space somewhere on a regular basis, and invite successful students AND their parents to describe to you how it’s done, based on the fact that some of you simply have no clue.

            [It’s not requesting a free hand out, but simply suggesting that a society that has discriminated against certain groups]

            Cal and the other UC campuses don’t admit “groups”. They admit INDIVIDUAL STUDENTS. What happened to others in your particular group 50, 100, 200 years ago is irrelevant. There are plenty of students whose immediate relative suffered injustices in far more recent history, yet that’s not preventing them from making the cut. No student today suffered under slavery or Jim Crow. Stop making excuses for the poor performance of others – it’s really getting kind of old…

    • God’s Child

      She has white traits. Alisha is black/Irish on her Dads side and Russian/Portuguese on her mom’s side. Only her birth certificate decided her race.

  • meh

    oh max jason. no one would be kicked out of the university. but we can change the admissions policies to create an integrated university. and really, you think that it’s bad for the numbers of overrepresented students to go down? is that somehow supposed to be WORSE than the number of underrepresented students going down?

    • 1776

       Its bad to admit students that do not meet the standards of the University of California regardless of race. Maybe if underrepresented minorities wanted more of their own to be admitted to the University they should step up and get better grades in HS or Jr. College.

      • Carlos

         Alisha Johnson — why don’t you ask the black students who are enrolled why they aren’t in OChem.  If currrent black students are afraid of stem classes, what makes you think having more student will solve the problem.  Letting in more blacks means the majors that currently attract black students will just have more students.

      • Stan De San Diego

        Cal and other UC campuses do admit transfer students from community colleges, many of them who didn’t do well in HS but eventually saw the light, applied themselves, and maintained decent enough GPAs to make the cut. There’s simply no excuse to water down the requirements for admission, unless the goal is (which I have long suspected) warm bodies and empty skulls to populate useless/worthless courses such as PACS and the various grievance studies programs, ensuring that certain left-leaning profs have a reason to justify their existence on campus.

        • Guest

          Speaking of which, most of the CC admits are well under the mark performance wise as well.  Berkeley at least would do well to eliminate most candidates from this notorious “back door”.

          • CITE_FACTS_USE_LOGIC

            Maybe this is specific to EECS, but most of the CC admits i’ve met in EECS do just as well as non-transfers.

          • Stan De San Diego

             I would beg to differ. Many CC admits are older students, including military vets who are returning to school after finishing their enlistment commitments. In fact, at the CC where I took my physics courses, the physics prof used to mention that the test score distribution represented a bifurcated distribution – the military vets on the top peak, everyone else at the bottom. The hardest working group of students I ever met were a bunch of Navy “mustangs”, i.e. enlisted guys going to school to earn their officer commissions. Given that these individuals get accepted readily at UC schools and more importantly, actually GRADUATE (something that many AA admittees have a hard time doing) in coursework of substance (the Navy is looking for people they can train to run nuclear aircraft carriers and submarines, NOT ethnic studies majors), comparing them to AA types is completely out of line.

    • Guest

      The university is already “integrated”.

      There’s a pretty quick fix to this – URMs need to perform better academically; they need to change their culture to focus on schoolwork.  Blacks from Beverly Hills perform worse academically than some of the poorest Asians in California.  I know it’s hard work, certainly tougher than mindless protesting…