Anti-BDS bill would have stifled free speech on campus

Irene Chen/Staff

This week, a student senate committee voted 5-0 to indefinitely table a bill calling on the ASUC and Chancellor Nicholas Dirks to condemn the activism of UC Berkeley faculty and students advocating for boycott, divestment, and sanctions against Israel. BDS is a campaign of international solidarity with members of Palestinian civil society, who in 2005 asked the global community to place economic and institutional pressure on Israel until it respects Palestinians’ human rights under international law. An essential part of BDS on campus is the academic boycott, which calls on scholars and universities not to cooperate, financially or otherwise, with Israeli institutions that refuse to speak out against their government’s policies.

The bill, deceptively titled “A Bill in Support of the Free Flow of Ideas and International Academic Collaboration,” is nothing of the sort. Rather, it aims to stifle campus Palestine solidarity, explicitly attacking the UC Berkeley professors involved in coordinating an international campus day of action Tuesday. The bill demands that the administration and student leaders erroneously declare the activities of pro-Palestinian organizers to be in violation of academic freedom, while making no mention of Israel’s routine material violations of Palestinians’ academic freedom.

This bill tellingly neglects to explain the reason for the academic boycott. Israeli universities are apartheid institutions in an apartheid state: Jewish applicants are three times more likely to be offered admission than Palestinians, only 1 percent of faculty at Israeli universities are Palestinian, and none of Israel’s eight universities teach in Arabic. Furthermore, like universities in the United States, Israeli institutions actively collaborate with the government in numerous areas such as the development and application of military technologies Israel uses to violate Palestinians’ most basic rights, including their right to education.

The state that reduced universities and schools to rubble during its massacre in Gaza this summer also massively underfunds schools for its Palestinian citizens. Israel’s racist transportation checkpoints, which allow Jewish Israelis to pass freely while detaining Palestinians for hours or even days, make freedom of movement impossible for Palestinian scholars and students, who are regularly prevented from attending conferences, accepting offers to study abroad or simply making it to class every day.

In the bill, however, these crucial facts on the ground are nowhere to be found. This privileging of abstract Israeli academic freedom over actual Palestinian lives is disturbing. It also fundamentally misrepresents what the academic boycott is in order to exclude it from the realm of acceptable discourse. The bill claims, for example, that the academic boycott entails “stifling partnerships and research with Israeli academics for the sole reason of their national origin.”

This just isn’t so. On the contrary, BDS is consistent with academic freedom, because — according to the official guidelines for the academic boycott — it doesn’t target individuals, only institutions. As renowned UC Berkeley scholar Judith Butler explains, “The only request that is being made is that no institutional funding from Israeli institutions be used … scholars can continue important collaborative work with Israeli filmmakers, sociologists, philosophers, archaeologists or artists outside of Israel”.

In fact, it’s those who advocate Palestinian rights and BDS who face political and administrative repression. In August, the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign revoked the job offer of prominent Palestinian American scholar Steven Salaita over his vocal defense of Palestinians and criticism of Israel. Faculty and students are now organizing impressively around Salaita’s case. Phyllis Wise, the university’s chancellor, doubled down on her decision in an email about “civility” to the UIUC community that echoes the recent one sent by our own chancellor about the need for a “balance between communal interests and free expression.”

Civility isn’t an academic norm, and there is simply no “communal interest” in curtailing UC Berkeley’s celebrated history of free speech in order to attack and misrepresent Palestine solidarity activism. By voting to postpone SB 11 indefinitely, the ASUC refused to affirm a factually incorrect bill that is devoid of context and suppresses open debate about Israel and Palestine by marginalizing campus organizers. A “yes” vote would have affirmed Dirks’ apparent belief that it is in the “communal interest” to legitimize Israel at the expense of Palestinians, when in reality nothing delegitimizes Israel more than its own racist policies.

If you want to be part of the international day of action or just learn more about Israel and Palestine, please join us Tuesday at 11:30 a.m. on Sproul Plaza. We hope to see you there!

Kumars Salehi is a doctoral student in German literature and culture and a member of Cal Students for Justice in Palestine.

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  • DocReality

    Look who’s spreading hate-speech under the guise of free-speech. Soon, they will rename this publication the DailyCal-iphate.

  • Arafat

    This describes Ali perfectly:

    “As Nikolai Sennels said, a Muslim never sees himself as the
    cause of his own actions. It is all external reality and everything is the will
    of Allah or the fault of the Big Bad Infidel. Hence the eternal victimhood
    status, the rage, the search for external culprits, hence the jihad. You can’t
    expect anything else from people who are incapable of taking a long hard look
    at themselves and who have been told since the cradle that this look is only
    reserved for the infidels.”

  • kane Ali

    Care to provide a link to these “respected journalists worldwide”? Because the world’s consensus has been resounding for years on this issue, and it disagrees with Israeli propaganda.

    Hamas has acknowledged, as has everybody else, that they occasionally fire from crowded civilian neighborhoods. No Hamas official, Human Rights Group, or UN officials, has EVER said Palestinians were guilty of firing/storing weapons in schools/hospitals/shelters, places Israel routinely strikes.

    Also, I’m glad you glossed over the fact that even if Hamas did use Human Shields, Israel is still in violation of the law, based on their disproportionate use of force (a rocket stored in a home, Israel blows the apartment building down).

    Human Rights Watch is a respected organization by most of the world (excluding the countries whose dirty laundry they are revealing). Regardless, Amnesty International and the UN both agreed with HRW, that Hamas/Palestinians did not use human shields.

    LOL of course, I was waiting for it. Those who disagree with Israel are “anti-Israel” and affiliated with Nazi’s.

    • DocReality

      C’mon Kane Ali. It’s not that you hate Israel. We know that.

      You hate who’s IN Israel.

      Are you angry that Hitler didn’t finish the job?
      It’s okay. Tell the truth. You’re not in Iran. There’s still free speech here.

  • Dan Spitzer

    Alas, Arafat, the DC editors always extoll freedom of expression, as they rightfully should. But then they turn around and censor that which doesn’t sound politically correct. Talk about hypocrisy!
    Ditto the paper’s reportage which egregiously printed that there were 250 pro-Palestinians at the Sproul Hall rally when in reality there were less than a hundred…

  • SamXie

    It is positively Orwellian to deny academic freedom and the free exchange of ideas in the name of free speech

    • joyceforjustice

      check ur privlege they are killing babies in gaza and all you care abot is ur free speech how selfist!

  • Arafat

    “To learn who rules over you, simply find out who you are not allowed to criticize.”-
    Evidently for this paper the rulers are Muslims. You know, Hamas lovers and their ilk.

    • kane Ali

      LOL right, this paper is a front for the Muslim Brotherhood selling prayer rugs and hookah’s to unsuspecting Americans. Get real.

      • Arafat

        Then why cannot western papers publish cartoons of Allah without fear of Muslims going all Muslim (insane) over it?

        Why do people like Salaman Rushdie and Ayaan Hirsi Ali live with 24/7 security detail simply because they spoke truthfully about Islam?
        Why is are political class and main stream media banning the use of words like Jihad, Infidel, Kuffar, Taqiyya or quoting the endless Qur’anic verses calling for death to non-Muslims?

        • kane Ali

          1% or less of Muslims worldwide protesting against racist cartoons isn’t an issue.

          Rushdie and Ayaan are two people. The world is filled with thousands of public figures who say the most savage things about Islam/Muslims, none of them have bodyguards or are attacked.

          Nobody considered serious in progressive/liberal society is advocating the banning of any of the things you mention.

          • Arafat

            Oh yeah. I forgot it was 1% or less – the usual Muslim apologist lie.
            Riddle me this 1,000,000 Muslims died in the Iran/Iraq War. Were they part of that 1%?
            How many millions of refugees in Syria, Sudan, Mali, Nigeria, |Somalia, Pakistan, Afghanistan have been created by this >1%?
            How many Hamas-like organizations have been elected by this >1%?
            Why is it survey after survey show that 50% of Muslims stand behind what Osama Bin Laden stood for? Is 50% more than 1%?

          • kane Ali

            Muslim apologist lie? It was CNN and University of Chicago that concluded .01% of Muslims are terrorists. A greater percentage of Americans are child abusers.

          • Arafat

            Islam is like a poison, spreading death wherever it goes.
            Syria, Sudan, Afghanistan, Somalia, Iran, Pakistan, Yemen, Mali, Libya, Lebanon, Algeria, Bosnia, southern Russia, NW China, southern Thailand, Kashmir, Israel, Bangladesh, Mauritania, Niger……

          • disappointed

            “Muslim apologist lie? It was CNN and University of Chicago that concluded .01% of Muslims are terrorists.”

            So that makes the other 99.99% like you, merely stupid for expending time and effort defending their murderous and counterproductive actions, correct? Are you really stupid enough to think that shooting rockets at Israeli civilians is going to change opinion in Israel? You can blather all you want about world opinion, but at the end of the day, outside of the usual agitators and marginal kooks, nobody outside the Middle East really cares. Other than a handful of rogue states that are universally condemned across the planet (Iran, Syria, North Korea), who is going to step up to the the plate and supply military aid to Hamas?

            Get a clue. Hamas’ suicidal war against Israel is just that – suicidal and stupid. More Palestinians will continue to die if they pursue the idiotic course of action you
            pathetically defend.

          • kane Ali

            Wow thanks for pegging me as Muslim, I guess I’ve converted.

            Also, nobody really cares about public opinion in Israel, they are depraved, due to brainwashing by their rabid government.

            What’s needed for the end of Israel’s apartheid regime on Palestine, isn’t military intervention from North Korea or Hamas rockets, but a coalition of nations who impose penalties on Israel for continuing their war-crimes, like what happened with South Africa.

            The worldwide coalition has formed, and though slow-going, penalties are coming..

          • Arafat

            Muslims do
            not have to abandon their identities. They have to abandon the hatred planted
            in their brains by the institutional hatred inherent in the Koran , Haidith and
            the Sunnah.

            It is so
            chic to play the Muslim card to avoid criticism of Islam.

            Sorry – It
            is a fact – Islam teaches hatred.

            What the
            heck do you think drives the killing machine called ISIS?

            The minute
            we are free to talk about Islam is the minute Islam will start to fall apart.
            It is a fragile ideology that cannot stand up to introspection. Why would
            anyone believe that a 54 year old child pedophile was a prophet?

            If Muslims
            are so sure about their “religion” why do they try to stop discussion
            about its obvious flaws?

          • Dan Spitzer

            So Israelis are “depraved due to brainwashing by their government.” Thanks friend of Ham-Asswipes. You have outed yourself as a true anti-Semite, to say noting of being an ignoramus. Of course, the two always walk hand-in-hand.
            Arafat and disappointed, this is the sort of loser who sits typing alone with no social life other than with fellow Jew haters. He may have a career as a cashier at McDonalds as his failure to read should not be a detriment to such work as the cash registers are said to have pictures rather than words…

          • kane Ali

            Of course, the anti-Semite card.

            >90% of Israeli’s supported what the rest of the world is calling genocide and war-crimes. US reporters even referred to Israeli’s as “scum”, as they sat atop hills, cheering and drinking as Israel shot missiles at Palestinian hospitals and schools.

            Most of the world consider the type of people who do that scum. Of course, there were brave Jews across the world protesting Israeli’s apartheid, but in Israel, they numbered at <5%.

          • disappointed

            He didn’t say anything that I found to be incorrect, Ali Baba.

          • joyceforjustice

            doent beleve anything about jews because they know tricnology and minister farakann told us all about it an that is the tureth!

          • disappointed

            “Wow thanks for pegging me as Muslim”

            Well, you’re certainly stupid and irrational enough to be one, so what else should you expect?

          • disappointed

            “1% or less of Muslims worldwide protesting against racist cartoons isn’t an issue.”

            They aren’t “protesting against racist cartoons”. They are threatening people who are critical of their prophet with death. A bit of a difference, in case you did not know.

          • kane Ali

            Sure, whatever you want to call it. Protesting, threatening, pontificating, I take your point.

            The issue is, its a tiny minority of Muslims protesting, of which only a minority engage in murderous/violent behavior. To pretend, as many often do, that a joke about Islam results in millions of Muslims blowing things up, is just a myth.

          • disappointed

            “The issue is, its a tiny minority of Muslims protesting”

            And a larger percentage making excuses for them because they wish to play the victim.

          • kane Ali

            A greater percentage of white Americans molest/abuse children (statistically), then Muslims who are terrorists.

            If much of the world began associating White-America with child molester/abuser, that would be wrong, both morally, and statistically.

            If people pointed this out, they wouldn’t be making “excuses” or trying to play “the victim”, they’d be making sense.

          • disappointed

            “A greater percentage of white Americans molest/abuse children (statistically)”

            Somehow I would consider people who practice genital mutilation on their own children to be bigger child abusers than what goes on in America, but hey, that’s me.

          • Arafat

            Nice one disappointed. Something like 90% of Muslim women in Egypt have had their clitoris’ cut off. I guess in Ali’s world that is not abuse. LOL

          • disappointed

            Ali’s like one of those little ankle-biter dogs. He doesn’t understand reason, just getting smacked around a bit. He must like it, as he keeps coming back for more.

          • Arafat


            We are actually seeing Islam operate before our very eyes. The Mahoundians
            doing exactly what the Koran tells them to do.

            The German-American scholar Joseph Schacht, in his monumental academic tome
            ‘An Introduction to Islamic Law’:

            “The basis of the Islamic attitude towards unbelievers is the law of war;
            they must be either converted, or subjugated, or killed”.

            And that’s happening right before our eyes.

      • Dan Spitzer

        I’m disappointed that the Daily Cal editors removed most of the posts from Joyce, a member of the “Honorable” Louis Farrakhan’s Black Muslim mosque. Joyce, I apologize if I was hard on you as you told the “truth” as most Muslims in the world and members of Students for Justice in Palestine see it. Indeed, polls show conclusively that the vast majority of the planet’s Muslims believe what Joyce says: that not only were Jews behind behind 9/11 but are responsible for most of the evil in the world.

        The reason it saddens me to see the Daily Cal censor Joyce’s posts is that Joyce reflects the hatred of Jews and their “conspiratorial nature” which most of Muslims, including our local pro-Palestinian proponents believe. Joyce is simply more honest in openly acknowledging Islamic and local lefty hatred of Jews.

        In sum, please keep posting Joyce. The honesty that other members of the pro-Palestinian contingent hide which you fearlessly express is more than welcome…

  • kane Ali

    Hamas is standing with the UN (the entire world), in being prepared to accept a two-state solution on the legal pre-67 borders. Only Israel continues to reject this peaceful settlement of the conflict.

    And yes, Hamas as inflammatory, and at times, anti-Jewish rhetoric. Likewise, Israel also has inflammatory, and at times anti-Muslim rhetoric. Conflicts between two people’s generally share this characteristic.

    • Dan Spitzer

      Just “inflammatory” anti-Jewish rhetoric, Mr. Ali? Calls for Jewish genocide worldwide are the ultimate in odious values and you and your colleagues should condemn it just as any decent people (although not the Palestinian leader at the time, al-Husseini, who worked with the Nazis) would. But on this, you and your ethically-challenged colleagues are conspicuously silent.
      And of course, we never hear from your minion when it comes to the Palestinian predilection of honor murder or other maltreatment of females, to say nothing of jailing or killing homosexuals. From your brethren, complete silence on these practices. Suppression of dissent-decent Palestinians have long clandestinely complained about this, but if you do it openly you may have breathed your last…

      • kane Ali

        Outdated Hamas documents from 20-30 years ago have mean things in them. Israeli parties/politicians routinely advocate for the destruction/discrimination of non-Jewish Palestinians, and unlike Hamas, Israel has actually physically tried to accomplish it.

        Name me one well-known Palestinian supporter who has refused to condemn Hamas’s virulent statements or actions? You can’t? Didn’t think so?

        Al-Hussein was loosely affiliated with the NZ’s, like nearly every government in the world was, as well as many Jews. You can stop slinging that NZ mud, hoping something will stick.

        Everyone condemns Palestinians honor-killings/discrimination, but yes, when the atrocities committed by Israel against the Palestinians, dwarf the crimes committed by Palestinians by 100:1, we adjust our outrage meter to properly reflect this disparity.

        Also, the largest abuser of Palestinian homosexuals is Israel. Recent leaks by IDF soldiers and Snowden detail how Israel spies on then blackmails homosexual Palestinians to aid in Israeli war-crimes.

        (I substituted NZ for the groups that ruled WW2-Germany, because otherwise, my comments are deleted for some reason).

        • Dan Spitzer

          First of all, Hamas is clearly proud of its anti-Semitic charter clauses and its spokesmen always, when asked, affirm it. One would think to try to curry favor with the civilized world (the US and the EU who have condemned Hamas as a terrorist organization) that Hamas would alter words clearly calling for the murder all Jews. But the Hamas-Wipes have failed to do so because they believe in the annihilation of the Jews worldwide that their leaders have called for.
          Interesting that you have stood things on their head. Pro-Palestinian supporters have not condemned the Hamas Covenant as we have heard nary a one do so. Indeed, I have asked for this on the DC website many a time and have yet to hear a single solitary condemnation of this barbaric, racist charter. In this way, Hamas is no different from ISIS which also calls for genocide.
          Al-Husseini spent several years working for the Third Reich in engineering its Final Solution. Virtually every history book on al-Husseini acknowledges this. It’s mind-boggling to see your denial. Didn’t you take any courses in history at Cal save that taught by the likes of the demagogues in UCB’s Middle East Studies Dep’t.?
          Interesting how you wiggle out of the horrific treatment of Palestinians of their women and gays. There’s a reason why gay Palestinians and Israelis have set up sizeable counseling and aid offices for the scores of Palestinian gays who have fled for their lives from the W. Bank…

      • DocReality

        You can’t win with Muslims, Dan. They’re hard-wired to hate. If you studied their brains in detail, you’d see there’s a piece missing where morality and empathy usually fire up. In other words: genetically sociopathic, pre-disposed to hate.

        • Dan Spitzer

          Unfortunately, Doc, your words are all too true. One just has to look at the world, to say nothing of the centuries of bloodbaths between Sunni and Shiite to see the veracity of your post…

    • Arafat

      What is it about you Muslims? Can you not read? Can you not objectively study facts?
      Hamas’ basic charter calls for the annihilation of Israel. Is there something about this that you do not understand?
      Furthermore why would Israel trust a word the Palestinians say. Palestinians have lied about most every agreement signed with Israel. More importantly everywhere one looks in the Muslim world we see Muslims killing off non-Muslims. Israel sees this and they don’t want to be one of Islam’s next victims.

      • kane Ali

        I’m Muslim because my username has “Ali” in it? I am neither Muslim or Arab, so save your breath.

        Of course Hamas’s charter calls for nasty things (though their more recent documents from after the 1980’s, are more amicable). Likewise, Israeli politicians and political parties routinely call for no Palestinian State to ever be created, call for forced expulsions of Arabs from their homes, and on and on.

        Palestinians have clearly lied about some of their agreements, while Israeli’s have done the same. This is how these types of conflicts usually work.

        Everywhere you look you see Muslims killing non-Muslims. In the vast majority of the Muslim world, nothing of the sort is happening. It would in fact, be more statistically accurate to say everywhere one looks, Jews are killing off non-Jews (50% of Jews in the world are in Israel, 92% approved of Gaza massacre).

        • Arafat

          As Nikolai Sennels said, a Muslim never sees himself as the
          cause of his own actions. It is all external reality and everything is the will
          of Allah or the fault of the Big Bad Infidel. Hence the eternal victimhood
          status, the rage, the search for external culprits, hence the jihad. You can’t
          expect anything else from people who are incapable of taking a long hard look
          at themselves and who have been told since the cradle that this look is only
          reserved for the infidels.

          • DocReality

            Criterion A for anti-social personality disorder (aka sociopathy) with my added comments IN CAPS:

            A. There is a pervasive pattern of disregard for and violation of the rights of
            others occurring since age 15 years, as indicated by three (or more) of
            the following:

            (1) failure to conform to social norms with respect to lawful behaviors as indicated by repeatedly performing acts that are grounds for arrest (HIJACKINGS, BOMBINGS, BEHEADINGS, RAPE, HUMAN TRAFFICKING, MURDER, SUICIDE BOMBINGS)

            (2) deceitfulness, as indicated by repeated lying, use of aliases, or conning others for personal profit or pleasure (FALSE IDENTITY, FAKE PASSPORTS, POSTING LIES/MISINFORMATION AS SEEN ON THIS WEBSITE TODAY)

            (3) impulsivity or failure to plan ahead (DRIVING INTO A CROWDED STREET, SHOOTING UP A NEWSPAPER AGENCY OR BAKERY)

            (4) irritability and aggressiveness, as indicated by repeated physical fights or assaults (AMERICAN FLAG BURNING, BURNING IN EFFIGY, ANY ACTIVITY BY ISIS OR BOKO HARAM, OBNOXIOUS ON-CAMPUS PROTESTERS AT BDS RALLIES)

            (5) reckless disregard for safety of self or others (SUICIDE BOMBINGS, RAPE, TORTURE, ETC)

            (6) consistent irresponsibility, as indicated by repeated failure to
            sustain consistent work behavior or honor financial obligations

            (7) lack of remorse, as indicated by being indifferent to or rationalizing having hurt, mistreated, or stolen from another (ONCE AGAIN, AS INDICATED WITHIN THE MANY POSTS ON HERE)

            They are a criminal culture, rooted deeply in anti-social personality and behavior.

        • DocReality

          So what Kane Ali is now doing is practicing the Islamic custom of “taquiyya,” whereby he will lie and/or falsely assimilate into the culture to promote the true agenda of their so-called “Religion of Peace.”

  • Dan Spitzer

    First of all, the stats given in the op-ed regarding Israeli universities are total bullshit. In fact, any allegations of discriminatory treatment in Israel of its 20% Arab citizenry is given lie by the fact that next to none of them choose to move on to the West Bank which is roughly 100% Palestinian. And the Palestinians’ own polls show that their people living in Israel would never consider moving to the W. Bank.
    As for Salehi and his fellow SJP alleged advocation of free speech, Salehi writes: “An essential part of BDS on campus is the academic boycott, which calls on scholars and universities not to cooperate, financially or otherwise, with Israeli institutions that refuse to speak out against their government’s policies.” So if Israeli institutions support Israeli policy and/or don’t speak out against it, is this is a rationale for BDS vs them? Some advocacy of free speech you are, Mr. Salehi. Please also note that any Palestinian who speaks out vs his leaders’ policies does so at peril of his very life.
    Of course, by definition any sanction vs Israeli institutions of higher learning would also curtail interaction with Israeli faculty, including many who have saved lives with medical innovations and added to quality of life via technological development. Mr. Salehi would have students be so foolish to believe that BDS vs Israeli universities would not impede interaction between US academics and Israeli professors, the most important components of higher education. What flat-out rubbish. This would be the worst example of stifling free expression on campus that one could imagine…

    • kane Ali

      LOL great logic. So because Arab-Israeli’s don’t want to move to the occupied Palestinian territories, where they are under constant siege by an Apartheid-Israeli regime, then that must mean they aren’t discriminated against?

      By that same logic, Blacks in America never faced discrimination, because after all, they chose not to go back to Africa.

      Its not just that Israeli institutions haven’t condemned Israel’s war-crimes, they have actively participated. According to Haaretz, Israeli universities offered free tuition to soldiers committing genocide in Gaza, cracked down on liberal professors who spoke out against Israeli war-crimes, and tried to inhibit demonstrations/speech against the state.

      • Dan Spitzer

        What total rubbish, Ali. Polls conducted by Palestinian Israeli citizens say that they have enjoyed educational and economic opportunities not granted to them by the Palestinian authority in the W. Bank. Moreover, they have freedom of expression which they certainly don’t in the Palestinian territories. And that brings us to Israeli universities. Just like the US GI Bill after WW II, Israeli soldiers have opportunities to attend college. And remember, that means most of the Israeli population has an opportunity for further schooling as most Israelis are members of the army.
        What’s this bullshit about IDF engaging in “genocide?” You and everyone else with a semblance of a brain knows that Israel has the capability to carpet bomb the Palestinians into oblivion is it so wished. The only genocide in this part of the world is that advocated by the Ham-Asswipes as they openly do in both their charter and speech toward the world’s Jews. I doubt if you will comment on that reality, Mr. Ali, as you and your pro-Palestinian proponents always refuse to acknowledge the most important point in the entire Israeli/Palestinian conflict.
        As for cracking down on liberal professors and squelching demonstrations and speech vs the state, the only people doing this are the Palestinian Authority in the W. Bank and Hamas in Gaza. Israel ranks among the world’s freest societies when it comes to freedom of expression. On the other hand, if you criticize Fatah or the Ham-Asswipes, you may be jailed or shot.

        • kane Ali

          You aren’t able to read it seems. Nobody denies that Arab-Israeli’s enjoy greater economic opportunity in wealthy Israel, simply that even granting this premise, it doesn’t follow that since Arabs don’t want to leave their homes, they aren’t discriminated against.

          You do realize that a genocide can be committed without actually killing every last one of the ethnic group in question, right? By the standard you set, Germany didn’t engage in genocide against the Jews, because not every single Jew was killed?

          You can read about how Israeli universities are complicit/encouraging Israeli war-crimes, and how they are crushing dissent.

          Palestinians frequently criticize Fatah/Hamas, and nothing happens. A greater percentage of Israeli’s commit child abuse, then Palestinians who are shot for questioning leadership.

          • Arafat

            Right Ali. How do you define genocide?
            Is the fact that the Muslim population has more than quadrupled in Israel since 1948 fit your definition of genocide?
            Is the fact that Muslims (Palestinians) serve in Israel’s Parliament, are highly successful lawyers and doctors and businessmen in Israel an indication of genocide?
            It amazes me how lying is second nature to you. You had to been raised as a taqiyya-toting Muslim. Had to.

          • Dan Spitzer

            Wow, you really are one sick MF to compare those accused of child abuse to the number of Palestinians suffering because they had the courage to dissent. See international journalism colloquiums (try the Internet) condemning Fatah for jailing reporters and even closing some newspapers critical of the PA party and Abbas. Such censorship and punitive measures simply don’t happen in Israel which when it comes to dissent is among the freest societies in the world.
            As for the Palestinian Grand Mufti of Jerusalem al-Husseini’s lovely years in Berlin spent helping the Nazis engineer the Holocaust, if you both look up that lowlife via Google or go to Wikipedia on al-Husseini’s biography material, you will find any number of sources which affirm his disgusting role with the Nazis and why he had to flee to Tehran to keep from being put on trial by the Allies as a war criminal.
            As someone who lost family in the Nazi’s genocide, I deplore that you play fast and loose with a term which when applied to the Jews bears absolutely no correspondence with your poor, poor put upon Palestinians who also advocate the annihilation of Jews worldwide. That you would take such liberties on this matter means you are a particularly unethical individual and I won’t waste any more time responding to your anti-Semitic idiocies…

          • kane Ali

            There’s no doubt Palestinian officials can be intolerant of freedom of speech/dissent, but the issue I was addressing was the one you raised, namely, that Palestinians are “shot” if they disagree. Clearly, that isn’t true.

            Also, the 2014 Press Freedom Rankings are out, and Israel ranks just inside the bottom 50%, behind a handful of Muslim countries, for your information.

            I read al-Husseini’s Wiki-page. Most of the info is poorly sourced (which is why I rely on notable historians who say such links are tenuous at best), but even on Wiki, its made clear that he was never part of the extermination of European Jews.

            Regardless, I acknowledged that Husseini, like most world leaders at that time, had ties to Germany. What you failed to address, is the fact that many Jews had similar relations with Germany.

            Ah yes, we’ve reached it. My grandparents suffered in World War 2, you are anti-Semitic, rinse, lather repeat.

          • Arafat

            I interrupt Ali’s lies with some facts:

            Feb 13, 2013

            In another story the
            Western media apparently refuses to cover, any Palestinian who dares to criticize
            Hamas or the Palestinian Authority risks being arrested or summoned for

            Palestinian journalists are
            now hoping to bring this to the attention of President Barack Obama when he
            meets with President Mahmoud Abbas next month.

            The journalists say they
            want United States and the rest of the world to know that the crackdown on
            freedom of expression in both the West Bank and Gaza Strip is designed to hide
            the fact that Palestinians are governed by two repressive regimes that have no
            respect for human rights and democracy.

          • disappointed

            “There’s no doubt Palestinian officials can be intolerant of freedom of
            speech/dissent, but the issue I was addressing was the one you raised,
            namely, that Palestinians are “shot” if they disagree.”

            Hamas committed a bloody purge of Fatah members in Gaza back in 2005. Are you really that ignorant?

      • disappointed

        “LOL great logic. So because Arab-Israeli’s don’t want to move to the occupied Palestinian territories”

        They don’t want to move there because they have a better life, with more personal and religious freedom AND better economic prospects, as Israeli citizens than they do as so-called Palestinians, whose own leadership (at least in Gaza) views them as sacrificial lambs in their stupid and irrational holy war. But thanks for ignoring the truth.

        • kane Ali

          Of course they have better prospects in Israel, nobody denies this, yet everyone wants to keep harping about it.

          The issue is, that the fact that Arab-Israeli’s (not Palestinians) are more comfortable in Israel then the territories Israel has destroyed, does not mean Arab Israeli’s don’t face discrimination.

          Also, holy war? Hamas, however scandalous they can be, in’t fight a “holy war”, they are fighting for their land back (a struggle recognized as legitimate by most of the world and international law).

          • disappointed

            “Of course they have better prospects in Israel”

            Because unlike your Palestinian heroes, Israel is indeed a multi-racial, multi-ethnic democratic society where human rights are respected. How about if you hold Hamas and the government in Gaza to the same standard for once?

            “Also, holy war? Hamas, however scandalous they can be, in’t fight a “holy war”, they are fighting for their land back”

            Israel isn’t their land, and they aren’t going to get it by shooting rockets at them. Really now, how stupid can you be?

          • kane Ali

            You do realize that nearly every country (including Western ones), Human Rights Organizations, and the UN/World Court, disagree with the idea that Israel is a democratic human-rights respecting state, right?

            I do hold Hamas to the same standard, they’ve just committed far fewer human rights violations then Israel, so I speak about it far less. Its called being proportional.

          • Arafat

            For the last hundred years the best and brightest of the
            civilized world have been engaged in the business of peace. In the days before
            the Nobel Peace Prize became a joke, it was expected that scientific progress
            would lead to moral progress. Nations would accept international laws and
            everyone would get together to replace wars with international conferences.

            Instead technological progress just gave us better ways to
            kill each other. There have been few innovations in the moral technology of
            global harmony since Immanuel Kant’s “Perpetual Peace” laid out a plan to grant
            world citizenship to all refugees and outlaw all armies, invasions and
            atrocities with the whole shebang would be overseen by a League of Nations.

            That was in 1795 and Kant’s plan was at least more reasonable
            than anything we have two-hundred years later today because it at least set out
            to limit membership in this body to free republics. If we had done that with
            the United Nations, it could conceivably have become something resembling a
            humane organization. Instead it’s a place where the dictators of the world stop
            by to give speeches about human rights for a show that’s funnier than anything
            you could find eight blocks away at the Broadway Comedy Club.

          • disappointed

            “You do realize that nearly every country (including Western ones), Human
            Rights Organizations, and the UN/World Court, disagree with the idea that Israel is a democratic human-rights respecting state, right?”

            You do realize that when push comes to shove, at the end of the day, neither France nor Belgium nor Venezuela nor Brazil are going to come to the aid of Hamas the next time they get their butts kicked on a daily basis for being
            stupid, right?

            If being a stark raving pro-Palestinian idiot makes you feel important in the greater scheme of things (most likely a booster for your fragile self-esteem if you are an unemployable malcontent, which I strongly suspect), be my guest, but if you’re naive enough to equate shooting rockets at civilians with some type of
            liberation movement, you’re clearly as mentally disturbed as the rest of the bug-eyed screaming 7th Century throwbacks running around Gaza waving AK-47s and cackling like chickens. A bunch of loonie-tunes who think military genius is getting their own people killed with their tupid little suidical rocket strikes, and nothing more.

          • joyceforjustice


          • SamXie

            The Western democracies support Israel, but yes, among theocracies, autocratic regimes and dictatorships, the Palestinians have wide-spread support.

          • Arafat

            We interrupt Ali’s lies with some facts:

            The official media narrative is that these differences are
            the results of eons of oppression,

            checkpoints and blockades. Fair enough. But then why does
            the IMF put Israel’s

            GDP Per Capita well ahead of the oil rich kingdom of Saudi

            Saudi Arabia has no Israeli checkpoints, no Israeli soldiers
            or planes flying

            overhead. It has wealth literally pouring out of the ground
            with a fifth of the

            world’s petroleum reserves. And yet the IMF puts it 13
            places behind Israel and

            the World Bank puts it 8 places behind Israel. The only
            Muslim countries with a

            better GDP Per Capita rating than Israel are small
            monarchies drowning in oil.

            The non-oil Muslim countries who are closest to Israel are
            Malaysia and

            Lebanon, 32 and 33 places behind Israel. Both countries also
            have sizable

            non-Muslim populations. Muslims make up only 50 percent of
            Lebanon and only 60

            percent of Malaysia.

            38 places below Israel is Turkey, which until recently was a
            secular country

            and actually has a statistically significant atheist
            population. And that’s it.

            Below that we fall off a cliff into places like Belarus,
            South Africa and

            Grenada; all of whom still have better GDP Per Capita rates.
            No Muslim country

            without oil has a better GDP Per Capita than a Muslim
            country that has sizable

            Christian or Buddhist minorities.

    • SamXie

      Anti-Israel activist Huwaida Arraf, founder of the International Solidarity movement and advocate of boycotts of Israel planned to have her babies in Israel- because as Israeli citizens, they’ll be allowed free health care, and a variety of other perks. So even a Palestinian separatist can visit Israel, take advantage of Israel largesse, and ensure this for her children. It also shows that the most fierce of BDS activists overlook their “principles” when it comes to their vested personal interests.

      • Dan Spitzer

        Indeed, Sam, BDS activists are all about self-interest. In their overtly sanctimonious way, they are saying, “Look at me. Aren’t I wonderful that I support ‘poor people,’ even when they stand for genocide.”
        Yes, just scratch the surface of these fools and you will find the narcissism so manifest in both the Muslim true believers and the anti-Semites (sometimes the same) who project their self-loathing (see JVP) into hatred of Jews…

  • Dan Spitzer

    Indeed, they aren’t just worshippers. The leader of what Arafat dubbed in 1967, the Palestinian people (prior to that they were just known as Arabs), the “Grand Mufti of Jerusalem” al-Husseini, spent several years in Berlin helping Hitler play and implement “The Final Solution.” He later sought refuge in-surprise-Iran and he was Yasir Arafat’s most honored hero…

    • kane Ali

      This is false. There is no evidence by the scholarship on WW-2 Germany, that implicates any Palestinian as having anything other then a loose association with WW2 Germany, like most countries (and some Jews) had.

  • Stan De San Diego

    “The state that reduced universities and schools to rubble during its massacre in Gaza this summer” – The only “schools” being reduced to rubble are those that are being used to launch Qassam rocketd, which target Israeli citizens in cities such as Sderot. That happens to make them perfectly legal targets for the IDF to strike back. So why blame the Israelis for doing what you know damn well they are going to do (retaliate) instead of putting the blame on the Hamas fighters and/or rogue militia members launching these rockets in the first place?

    The BDS people are long on rhetoric. Too bad they aren’t really interested in an honest assessment of the facts.

    • RL

      This propaganda has been spread by the Israeli Army, which committed the aforementioned war crimes. It has not been confirmed by any international organization.

      One wonders, however, if the commentator above me would support bombing Israel’s University of Haifa, which has an army base in its top floor, or Israel’s Tel Aviv University, which is located right next to the secret service’s headquarters.

      • Stan De San Diego

        “This propaganda has been spread by the Israeli Army, which committed the aforementioned war crimes.”

        Sources and cites for your assertions?

        “One wonders, however, if the commentator above me would support bombing Israel’s University of Haifa”

        Are the Israelis using that location to shoot rockets at Palestinian citizens in the West Bank?

        • “Are the Israelis using that location to shoot rockets at Palestinian citizens in the West Bank?”

          In a word, yes. The IDF is an occupation army that uses Israeli “tech”, their weapons manufactured for world sale as an international arms proliferator, that is “field-tested” and bragged about in this way – those weapons are used against innocent civilians who support resistance against Israeli land and resource theft.

          It’s the same as the Israeli civilian mall connected by a skybridge to Israel’s military HQ.

          Using your logic, Palestinian militants would be well within your logical parameters if they hit those areas. I would expect you to be smugly silent that you were right in that case.

          Stan De San Diego says it’s cool with him if you guys [Palestinian militants] attack a place that is tangenitally connect to this conflict that is solely a university or other civilian infrastructure that might be used by someone directly participating in the conflict.

          You silly Hasbarians. You never follow out your own failed logic…

          • Dan Spitzer

            Dear Mr. Hess. Did I read it wrong or is your name Michael rather than Rudolf Hess? You say that the Israeli army has “bragged” about using weapons vs civilians. Quite the contrary. It’s the only army in history to ever warn civilians of an impending attack.
            On the other hand, the Ham-Asswipes just named as martyrs the two Palestinian members of Hamas, acknowledged to be the kidnappers and murderers of three Jewish teenagers, who were found hiding yesterday and then rightfully blown away by the Israelis. Hamas has acknowledged that these two lowlifes were members of its own and under orders by the Hamas hierarchy to kidnap and kill the young boys. Now that’s the conduct reflective of the pro-genocidal favorites of the Palestinian people, the Ham-Asswipes. And btw, at a huge rally yesterday the Palestinian people paid homage to this dead scum-sucking sewage…

          • kane Ali

            LOL Israel kills thousands of civilians with strikes on schools, hospitals, and markets. They warned nobody. The only warnings Israel gives are for residential area bombings, which regardless of how many flyers they drop, are still considered war-crimes.

            There is ZERO evidence that the two SUSPECTED killers of the Jewish teens hiking in occupied Palestinian territory, were acting under Hamas orders. Nobody (except Israel) has even insinuated as much.

          • Dan Spitzer

            Again, Mr. Ali, do please try to read the news. If you check any number of news and broadcasting outlets today, you will learn that not only did Hamas acknowledge order the kidnapping of the three murdered Israeli teenagers, they just held a big rally naming the killers as heroic “martyrs.”
            As for “thousands of civilians” Mr. Ali says were killed by Israelis, Hamas itself-from whom much of the international news services gained their figures-said that 2000 Palestinians lost their lives in the latest conflict. One half of them were said to be combatants. Where do your “thousands of civilians” come from? Not even the Ham-Asswipes opine this egregious absurdity.
            Tell us, Mr. Ali, do you always feel a need to fabricate your stats and other commentary? The Palestinian propaganda producers do a reasonably good job on their own w/o you adding your fictions to them…

          • kane Ali

            Provide us with evidence that Hamas, or any reputable new organization, claimed that Hamas ordered anybody to kidnap those Jewish teenagers.

            My “thousands” remark is referring to the numerous assaults on the Palestinians Israel has engaged in, not just the most recent skirmish.

            Also, the UN and Human Rights Organizations put the percentage of civilian casualties at 80%, not 50% (only Israel claims such a number).

            I haven’t fabricated anything, as you well know. The only ones that fabricate facts, are paid Hasbara interns, hired by Israel to spread their propaganda online. You douse comments boards in unsubstantiated lies, and when people counter, you simply yell “anti-Semitic” or “liar”.

          • Arafat

            While Muslims murder unarmed Buddhist monks
            in southern Thailand; and while Muslims gang-rape adolescent girls in Mali; and
            while Muslims commit genocide against the Copts and Chaldeans and Animists; and
            while Muslims create millions and millions of refuges in Sudan and Syria and
            Mali; and while Muslims behead aid workers and journalists and polio
            doctors…what do we hear about?

            Another American Muslim complaining not
            about his own people’s actions but about Israel instead. What sort of people do
            this sort of thing other than those who have been imprinted with the fear of

          • Arafat

            You can pretend lies are facts but that does not make them facts. The Israelis are nothing like Muslims – Muslims with their complete disregard for life. In fact Palestinians worship death over life. What does this say about Islam?

          • kane Ali

            I suspected you were a bigot for some time, but its bad manners to accuse somebody without verifying it through discourse. Thanks for making it easier to convince people which side has merit, good-day!

          • Arafat

            Palestinians worship martyrs. They name streets and village squares after them. They promise their children 72 virgins in paradise for dying in the pursuit of jihad. Muslims worship death. Israelis value life.

          • Arafat

            “Thanks to our strong faith we do not fear death, because we think
            that if you are killed by the hands of this regime, then we will be martyrs and
            we will go to paradise,” said Sheik Abu Ahmed, 41, a regional military
            commander for al-Nusra in the northern Hasaka region.

    • kane Ali

      According to various Human Rights Organizations, reporters on the ground, and UN investigations, there is no evidence that Palestinians (or Hamas) use human shields, or are firing/storing weapons in hospitals or schools where people are being sheltered.

      The sole source for this outrageous claim, is Israel, with no evidence being provided to substantiate it.

      Furthermore, simply throwing words associated with international law at people, does not fool those of us who actually know the law.

      EVEN IF Hamas were using human shields in the fashion you describe, Israel would only be legally entitled to respond, if they were responding with a proportionate amount of force, congruent to the threat they are facing. Seeing as how the threat Israel faces from Hamas bottle-rockets is nearly zero, none of Israel’s attacks on civilians in Gaza can be legally justified, and the international community has said as much.


      • Arafat

        Israel should also withdraw immediately from the United Nations
        (whose full name seems more accurately to be UNAI, the United Nations Against
        Israel) and help found a robust league of democracies, a new body where human
        rights violators don’t preside over human rights councils and where blocs of
        Islamists and communists don’t dictate to progressive republics. The UN might
        have arguably been the greatest endeavor man ever embarked upon; instead, it is
        a tiresome farce run by malevolent circus clowns. This is one club to which the
        Jew, and the Jewish State, should not belong and not wish to belong.

        • Arafat

          Turn the UN into a homeless shelter so that at least it does
          some good for the world. Wait a minute–if we do that, the entire New York City
          prostitution industry will be devastated.

        • kane Ali

          How can Israel help found democracies, when Israel itself isn’t a democracy that respects Human Rights?

          You could remove all non-democracies from the UN, and the results would be the same. The only countries that stands with Israel are the US, and occasionally Canada or Australia. The rest stand with Palestine.

          How ironic, that you wish to smear the UN, yet it was the UN that granted the Jewish state land in Palestine, of which they only legally owned 7%. Its also the UN that has accepted Israel’s theft of some of the land from the 1948 partition.

          • Dan Spitzer

            Yes, remove the authoritarian regimes from the UN, including most Islamic states, and you have few left. While some spokespeople in the EU have been critical of Israel, none in the UN has yet voted in favor of the two state solution you discuss.
            BTW, SJP wants a one state solution with, as evident by your chant, “Palestine to be from the ocean to the sea.” IOW, calling for the annihilation of Israel. How nice! This fits in neatly with your hallowed Hamas-Wipes call for Jewish genocide…

          • Arafat

            Israel IS a democracy. Unlike every single Muslim country, Israel holds elections and Palestinians vote in the elections. All votes get counted and Palestinians are elected to and serve in Israel’s Parliament.
            Israel is NOT like Muslim nations where outdated theocracies, dictators and royal pubahs run everything.
            Israel respects the rule of law. Western law, that is, not Sharia law which is a barbaric 7th century form of sadism masquerading as a set of laws.

          • kane Ali

            Israel is a democracy? A democracy doesn’t claim sovereignty over the West Bank and Gaza, then deny non-Jews the right to vote, as well as basic human rights. Arab-Israeli’s can vote/hold some offices, Palestinians cannot.

            By the way, the economist did a study on democracy in the Middle-East, and found that the only true Democracy was the Muslim state of Tunisia. Israel ranked below them, along with about 10 other Arab states, as “Democratic Facade”, not a true democracy.

            Israel respect the rule of law (or Western Law)? Most Western nations disagree.

          • DocReality

            Kane Ali – radical Berkeley student or clandestine ISIS-cell member?

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